Pero saliendo del tema politico un poco, donde estan las parodias de esta propaganda? las que hizo Tinelli en Videomatch?!! jaja!

If our standard is the gutter, which is what so many of our governments have been, then almost whatever we compare to that will seem impressive, including the Kirchners. They’re not taking people up in airplanes and throwing them into the river from thousands of feet up. Does that make them an impressive government? Our standard has to be higher, for those who govern and those who are governed. We should compare ourselves against what we can achieve.

This site is great. Keep it up. My only complaint is that maybe you concede too much to those who question you. Sometimes maybe you are too diplomatic.

Well put and fully agreed. I’m pretty confident most readers are able to digest the video for what it is: campaign propaganda. It’s obviously a one-sided piece aimed at making him look great.

Stay tuned for my next post about the Kirchners and how they – and Argentine presidents in general – differ from leaders elsewhere in their proclivity to undue the work of their predecessors.

Saludos,
Taos

This video is a simple political PR stunt to highlight some of Menem’s achievements — nothing wrong with that. However, it does not paint the whole picture of his tenure to make people perceive him as a hero or the good guy.

Asking what our present government could do better is valid – but we need to dig deeper than that.

Forming an absolute opinion about Menem based on this video is completely naïve, unbalanced, ignorant and bias. It shows a lack of knowledge of Argentina, its history and politics.

I think Taos is right, we need a more balanced vision of ourselves and our governments. We’re always arguing at each other, insulting each other (like you do Greg). I’m tired of that country. I don’t want it any more. We’re all in this together.

Menem pardoned Montoneros too, keep that in mind. Look, again, I’m not saying Menem was all good, but neither was he all bad. Let’s face the facts honestly.

I think this is a reasonable, balanced post.

No doubt about it…Thousands could be using the now extinct railway system, millions of USD would have been saved from transferring (and emptying) Aerolineas back and forth, we would have less “barrios cerrados” and more regular neighborhoods, a stronger middle class, less social and economic polarization (which is the root of most problems nowadays in Argentina), more local industry, less military represores out in the streets, less Bingos and Casinos, and on and on…I do also can’t help to compare him with GW, although Bush is directly responsible for the death of many more (while Menem’s known deaths can only be traced to the victims of the illegal arm sale to Ecuador and the AMIA bombing victims). To me the perfect example of the Menem years nonsense is that huge and extremely lot in Palermo that was used (with tax dollars) to build a multimillion dollar mesquite and muslim center. So much for separation of state and church. The place is barely used nowadays and no doubt will decay in the coming years. How about a park, hospital, etc. for the taxpayers instead? Not to mention his personal fortune increase (Kirchner style), superficial lifestyle, etc.

It is unimaginable to me to even consider that we that we would be in worse shape nowadays if Menem had never existed. I’d rather have a De la Rua, and that is a lot to say! (at least he was honest).
Cris

Thanks for leaving out the personal insults this time. Were they necessary the first time? Are you happy about yourself for having insulted me? What was your purpose in doing so? Do you think that doing so benefits anyone, wins you friends or helps you to convince people that your ideas are correct? Politics everywhere, but especially here in Argentina, are in desperate need of people who don’t question other people’s motives or insult or hurl spurious accusations. Why not elevate the level of dialogue by showing respect and genuine interest in others? Life is too short to waste it insulting others. Seriously. Let’s move forward with a bit more consideration and respect. The entire nation needs it.

As for the rest of your comments, I’d say this. Your cursory review of this blog seems to have been just that, cursory. When I say I’m interesting in knowing all sides of the issue, I’m serious. And, of course, you’re right, evaluating Menem’s administration means we should keep in mind what its policies led to afterwards, including the economic meltdown that followed in 2001-2002.

It’s not debatable that Argentina’s functioning telephone system, its inter-province highway system, and hospital networks improve enormously under Menem’s administration. They did. This is simple historical fact. What is debatable is if these improvements, and others, counterbalanced the other negatives.

As for your other accusation, here’s a link to a post I did looking at what CFK was doing right:

http://www.argentinepost.com/2009/01/what-cristina-is-doing-right.html

Finally, it seems to me that the best way to evaluate any administration is to compare it with what it’s possible of accomplishing. Could Argentina be doing better now? That’s the most relevant question to ask, not whether the Kirchners are better or worse than Menem or De la Rua or Duhalde.

Taos

Peace to you too. Thanks very much for your thoughts here.

Take care,
Taos

This isn’t about ideology or demonising people – the achievements you mention, as Gustavo pointed out, are, let’s say at best, rather debatable claims and nowhere do you ‘cogently form arguments’ to back up these statements.

A little look at 2001 and the traumatic and long term effects it wrought on Argentine society might be in order if you are really sincere about being balanced, nuanced and so on. Obviously I don’t believe this to be the case because a cursory review of your blog reveals it to be as black and white as the aquatic birds that the Kirchners owe their nicknames to. Have you ever asked of the current government ‘are they really as bad as the popular media portray?’. Do you ever try to take an alternate perspective and focus on some good things they’ve done? Do you ever try to portray them ‘for what they really were/are: the good, the bad and the ugly.’? No, but you try to do this with Menem of all people and then claim ‘my loyalty is to the truth, not to emotion or sentiment or partisan predilection.’ Nothing could provide a more telling indictment against the sincerity of this statement than your own ‘journalism’ on this blog.

I’ll leave you with the same question that was asked by Matias Fernando Robinson in a previous post: ‘Tell me please which government in the last 30 years has been better than Nestor’s or CFK’s?’

I appreciate your thoughtful reply and I apologize if I let my emotions rule my words. I will admit that I am not capable of being rational regarding either menem or bush, and I don’t expect to be anytime soon (meaning I probably don’t want to). Most victims of these types of criminals don’t feel they ever have closure unless justice is done. I don’t expect any justice for either one of them, and so probably not much closure for me.

Peace