Argentina to Charge Americans an Airport Entry Fee
The Argentine government will start charging U.S. citizens an aiport entry fee of US $131 starting December 20, the U.S. Embassy said in a notice Friday.
Last year Argentine officials announced plans to start charging such a fee, but then suspended them in a confusing change of position. But the plans are now back on track and any American citizen – who isn’t a resident of Argentina – will have to pay the fee starting December 20.
The fee will also likely apply to residents of other countries whose governments charge visa application fees to Argentines who travel to those countries. The fees will likely vary country by country, depending on how much those countries charge Argentines.
A government official said last year that the reciprocity fee “would not lead even a single person to not visit the country.”
However, that statement seems overly optimistic and is almost certain to lead at least some people to think twice about coming to Argentina.
Over the past year, more than 40 people have emailed The Argentine Post to say they would cancel their Argentine travel plans if the fee were implemented, indicating that the fee’s impact on tourism will be at least moderately negative.
It will be a one-time fee allowing Americans to enter the country multiple times over the period of 10 years.
In a message to U.S. citizens, the Embassy had this to say:
“This warden message is being issued to alert U.S. citizens that on December 20, 2009, the Government of Argentina will begin charging American Citizens visiting Argentina for business or tourism an entry fee of $131 U.S. dollars. The fee will be collected only at Buenos Aires Ezeiza International Airport. Once paid, the fee permits multiple entries into Argentina for ten years in accordance with United States visa reciprocity. Americans may pay in dollars, by credit card, or with travelers checks.”
Popularity: 2% [?]
Same here in Brazil. This tit for tat is good politics for local politicians, but not good economics. Argentina needs all the foreign income they can get unlike Brazil, which is on a roll….for now.
Nuestros Hermanos sure like to complicate things!
ExpatBrazil
I just returned from Brazil via Buenos Aires airport. I was in transit to Santiago Chile and need to collect my bag so as I could board my Santiago flight. When I got off the plane I went to the information desk, they told me I needed to go though immigration. The person behind the counter pretty much could not speak english. In the end I lined up at immigration and showed my passport. They then told me I need to fill in the immigration card, I again explained I needed to collect my bag. I was then told fill in the card, I did this and then lined up again. Then after handing in my immigration card so as I could collect my bag, I was then told to pay $100 US, by this time I was having a heart attack. In the end I payed the money, re-lined up again and got through immigration. I then had to walk into the next terminal with my bag and re-board my new flight. The whole episode was total and utter hell. I would be see dead in Argentina, pretty much the Argentinans can stick it up their ass. Your treatment of foreigners is totally and untter unacceptable. I be back to Brazil anytime.
I see your english is not very good…and you should not use such bad language. Argentinians have all the rights to treat US citizens like this as they are non treated any better at the US consulate when they try to get a tourist visa to go to the US. Not only they have to pay $131, but they have no guarantee that such visa will be granted. As if entering the US on tourism was such a privilege. Please give me a break. My boyfriend was denied a tourist visa by a fat disgusting clerk who just decided he was not “worthy” of visiting the US. PLEASE!! Get the facts before you criticize the Argentinians.
European countries don’t ask Argentinians to get a visa, or charge anything to get into the various countries of the union. I think the US should take example from them and abolish the visa requirements from Argentinian citizens.
Dear Dali Bentolila — It’s so refreshing to hear your comment; you’re not definitely a yank.
I’m working with a group of college students who are volunteering 2 weeks of their winter vacation to help communities near Buenos Aires. They are all paying their own expenses which is difficult in these tough times, but they are committed to helping. Can this fee be waived for volunteers who give up their time and help support local organizations in Argentina?
Is there a process to seek a waiver?
Oh, and a nice WAIVER would be to go back to letting Argentineans enter the US with no visa, just like not so long ago, we used to have that. An eye for an eye hurts now? just because it’s not US imposing the rules?
yes the visa requirement for Argentinians who wish to go to the US is absolutely unfair, arbitrary and just wrong. I am all for reciprocity, no visa either way, no fee, nada.
The US Embassy charges a visa fee to Argentinians when the Embassy’s personnel actually is doing a job. On the other hand: Argentinian Government, out of the blue, comes out imposing a “reciprocity entrance fee” of U$S 131, for doing what? Just that: collecting the money! That is very bad policy! Good luck Argentinians with this vengeance fees!
We, Americans chanrge a visa fee because we want to make sure you guys don’t come to our country to stay and enjoy our freedom. We, Americans don’t come to Argentina to stay, we come to spend money. The minute you become a power as the United States then you can talk about reciprocity.
I guess it can be cool to say “Oh yeah USA?? Well take THIS! Bam! Fee to enter our country! What a moral victory.” But that only hurts your country. I would visit Argentina because my dollar goes farther there. If I have to pay $130 just to step foot in your country, I’ll simply go visit another cheaper country.
Sure, you could threaten the same thing but America is huge, do you think anyone would even notice if US tourism from Argentines dropped to zero?
It’s a dumb move on your dumb government’s part, it’s only going to hurt every industry and your economy overall.
I am doing a post-doc in the US, the US govmnt never renewed my visa for more than a year, plus my wife has to pay for a work authorization to work in the US, plus there are things I can not deduct from my taxes like other residents can, and I have to put certain money in Social Security retirement, which I won’t have the right to claim if don’t become a citizen. So, every year we have to pay 2*131 + 250 + what ever we can not deduct from taxes + social security, that is at least 2000 dollars a year. The US “impuesto al boludo”.
$131 for 10 years charged by Argentina doesn’t seem too much in comparison.
Oh, I forgot the phone pin, $10 that we have to pay just to be able to call to the embassy.
By the way, here you pay $131 and you enter to Argentina. The other way around is different, you pay $131 and you can still be denied the visa, or be rejected at the US entry point. Sorry, no refunds.
My answer to you “boludo”: It is very simple: THEN DON’T WORK IN THE UNITED STATES! Go back to Argentina and look for a GOOD paying job there, if you are lucky you don’t even wil make enough to get to the end of the month!
Ok Dorian. I understand you want “cheap” tourism. Go visit Ghana or Zimbabwe then!
Are we (US citizens) forgetting how much WE charge for entering the US??? Huh?? Let me refresh your memory, particularly for Argentineans:
a) When an Argentinean applies for a US visa, and regardless of s/he gets it or not, they have to pay a *non-refundable* US$131 fee.
b) The visas US issues are sometimes valid for one trip, which could be as short as you want it to be (if you want another visa, pay again).
c) A big percentage of people walk out of the embassy WITHOUT their US visa.
d) It costs Argentineans A LOT MORE than it costs US citizens to earn the US$131
e) US citizens are NOT denied entry to Argentina, they’re just asked to pay a fee
f) Argentina’s fee is valid for way longer than a US tourist visa.
US has to stop whining, and stop being cheap. Aregentineans don’t treat US people like garbage at the airport (immigration) just like we do at our airports. Next time look at the people in the long lines next time you come back from an international trp and you’ll see the difference.
Is fair the fee to the americans from argentines! come on! i know is a pain in the,,, but me being argentine for example, to enter into US is much more painfull!! ,, im considered as the last person americans want to allow to enter in the country ( according to the political/ economic shi,,,, ) cause im from an “emerging country”,,thats why many argentines honours their european ancestors and take an european passport,, u see the difference in a matter of seconds,, NO DA! but is like that .. so guys dont complain about it,, now i got a question , if somebody knows the answer please let me know, im travelling to US next thursday with my bf that is american, and he has been illegal in the country for an year( lets say, this would be TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE FOR US),, do u know how much is the fee he ll have to pay?
I think it’s only fair. It’s a reciprocity fee and it wouldn’t be charged if the US didn’t do the same to Argentineans.
BTW, I stopped travelling to the USA when they started requiring a visa to enter the country and I’ve been to Europe three times since. Although Europe is more expensive, I don’t want to experience the apalling treatment foreigners are subjected to when entering the US.
For an American tourist visiting the region, fees will sum up. Visiting Chile, Brasil and Argentina all together will come up to 390 per person. It is most likely that someone visiting anyone of these three countries will also visit the other two or at least one more. If a couple is visiting Chile and Argentina a most likely situation , then the fees for the couple would be around 520 dollars. I feel this will deter some tourists to consider these destinations.
My question is will this fee will be charged only in Ezeiza Airport, how about the Aeroparque Airport in Buenos Aires >?
Will the fee not be charged in other cities, or coming by ferryboat from Uruguay>?
well done Argentina! I totally agree on this reciprocity fee. after all, i dont understand all this fuss about it. people from South America have to pay those fees just to APPLY for a visa in the USA and other countries, with no guarantee they will get it. so well done! – Americans who complain, should do so to their OWN government, who treats foreigners arriving to the USA as potential criminals, not to mention rudeness, arrogance and all in all extremely unpleasant experience. by the way, if you travel on holiday it doesnt need to affect you. travel to uruguay and enter the country from there. if you are going to chile, travel then further to salta or mendoza and enter chile via land from there, won’t be charged a dime.
Thanks for the information!
I guess Cristina has to make some extra money to pay her bills….
As an airline employee growing up in Buenos Aires I travel to Buenos Aires for personal trips several times a year. No more! Too much corruption, too dangerous…and now an airport entry fee!
Yes, I will miss the country, the city and her wonderful people… but they will miss our U$D’s more if we elect not to travel there!
Reconsider it Cristina…. and spend the money on another facelift. El tiempa pasa!
How to spend $131. Even a facelift for Cristina will be more productive than feeding $131 the Department of Homeland Security, to promote hate and war in the world. Homeland, that word reminds of Fatherland, you know of the Nazi type.
Again, I may rather not charge anyone for travel in the first place.
Nazi type? you mean like Peron?
yes, among many others.
Why not Aeroparque as well? If, in fact, this really occurs and is only for once in ten years and not each time, then I suppose it is only fair considering what the Argentines have to go through to get visas for the U.S. I do still think, however, they will loose many tourists.
If Brazil did the same thing that would be fair as well but for Americans traveling to Brazil from Argentina, we must deal with the mountain of paperwork, hostility and pay the fee EVERY three month period which is the same price for a five year visa to Brazil issued within the U.S. I have stopped all travel to Brazil. Its just not worth it.
Martin, esta claro que sos argentino hablando en contra de Brasil. Que boludez.
No entiendo la ultima linea de tu comentario, si decis que es mas barato la visa de 5 años para viajar a braisl, pq entonces dejaste de ir para alla???
Por los problemas en Argentina, seguro.
I think of thing you DO NOT KNOW is that ARG did not accept the US rules for the digital chips in passports after 9/11. Those rules seemed like something the world agreed upon, but no: they were imposed by the US.
But ok, the thing works and that has a cost too. All the system.
What about Argentina? You might well go to migraciones and find out they lost data about your entries in the country, cuzz it is all manual, and old, and horrible.
IF only the money went to that. But OH, no.
I am with you brother, Brazilians are worth crap. I go to Brazil because my employer sends me and he pays for it, but I would not pay a dime to these smelly people. Just remember the foul smell when you travel from Rio’s airport to the city. Also, they need to remember the plane loads of illegals being deported every month to Brazil. How many Americans are being deported to the US every month? We go there to spend money, not suck their poor people.
I did forgot to mention one other point? WHERE is this money going to go? Probably in the pockets of the Kirchners or their henchmen just out of spite. THAT is the problem. It will not go towards anything beneficial.
Not that I can afford to travel to Argentina, but this makes it even less likely. With my family of 4, it would cost me more than $500 extra. Doesn’t seem like a smart decision.
True what AR says but there is a thing called marketing and the needs of each country.
People from all over wish to come to the US, on the other hand much less people wishes to visit Argentina.
For Argentina it is a big issue to get foreign currency through tourism, the US does not seem to be the same situation…
I believe that tiny Uruguay is wise, it should not be tempted to imposse such a fee,
Uruguayans are charged as much as Argentineans to visit the US , but it seems to me they are in greater need of foreign more tourism .
I recently visited Buenos Aires and found out that many hotels are offering all kind of promotions….what does this tell you?
The “marketing argument” has a name, it is called “exploiting the dominant position”. Remember that there is no product to sell or trade here or be short of. “Exploiting the dominant position” is something some of us regard as bad. (to make the picture complete, “Retaliation” is also regarded as bad.)
In any case, even if it hurts tourism, I think the $131 for US citizens seems to be the only way (after many years of waiting) for the US gvmnt to at least think about not charging $131 to Argentineans. If they US didn’t charge for visas (or even reduce the fees) then it will be a great benefit for Argentineans as a whole and it will solve the problem in a snap.
Easy, no? yes, we could.
Sorry, but this is not true. Brasil charges US citizens for years now and the US never reconsidered not charging Brazilians.
On the other hand, still US citizens go to Brazil AND not to mention europeans, specially from nordic countries.
@NA, We never know what these geniuses in the Dept. of Homeland Security consider or stop considering, they are so intelligent that the best we can do is guess. Now, having both Brazil AND Argentina, AND maybe other countries charging for visa will make some of their US citizen realize what their own government is doing, and complaint to it. We also know that very powerful people travel to Argentina and can realize about the situation that otherwise will not notice. (like Governor Sanford, sorry just a joke.)
As long as the reasons are clearly stated, then the measure have a chance of being effective. That is the (arguably questionable) logic behind it. I rather prefer no visa fees at all for anyone.
These high fees are the reason Brazil, Chile, and Bolivia have not been as popular with American tourists—especially families—as Argentina and Ecuador. A family of four will now pay $524 more to visit Argentina than they will to visit Peru. That’s a deal breaker for anyone who has to watch their budget, especially since Peru is a better value anyway in terms of hotels and transportation.
As others have noted, if the U.S. got ZERO Argentine visitors this year, hardly anyone would even notice. It’s a tiny fraction of our tourism numbers and foreign tourism is a tiny fraction of our economy. Argentina will be hurt badly if the number of U.S. visitors declines though. Just ask anyone there who actually works in tourism.
As they say in the U.S.:
“What’s good for the goose, is good for the gander.” If we, in the U.S. can charge, so should other countries towards us. Though I was born in the U.S., my father is Argentine so I feel I have a right to opine. I am over the arrogance of this country on how since 9/11/01 (and before for many, but certain countries deemed so by the U.S.), their behavior has been reprehensible on how it has treated tourists and immigrants at U.S. consulates and fees imposed to travel to the U.S. And the beauty is that when people are denied a visa, no rationalization is provided. I think it’s about time other countries return in suit. Basta, ya!
Argentina needs to follow Brazil’s example and start imposing full visa requirements on the citizens of those countries who do the same with the Argentinians. Argentina also needs to start tracking all those expats for visas violations, overstays, etc.
I cannot agree, first of all the US charges for a visa which envolves some work.
Expensive>? Fair or not? The US has it reasons and its inmigration policy, good or bad, there is one. Countries have always charged for giving visas . All countries.
The entry fee per se is a retallation. Of course Argentina has the right to impose it.
As far as I know there is no work involved from Argentinean diplomats and I guess it has nothing to do with its inmigration policy. However I might be wrong.
But the procedures to give or not a visa and on the other hand charging a mere fee when a person arrives to a country seems a different thing.
What I wished to say, is it in the best interest of a nation that needs foreign currency and needs to keep active its tourism industry>?
Of course again I might be wrong, may be things are fine in Argentina.
Mary and everyone,
US visa process involves some work that they may rather not do. US decides unilaterally that for Argentineans they need to do “work”. Of course it is a “work” that they consider that they don’t need to do for the French or for Spanish or for the English.
So, I have to go to the embassy (every time I travel) and I have to pay for the investigation they do on myself. They can take my word for it and it will be much cheaper for everyone. If you are going to investigate someone please don’t go through the humiliation of charging that same person.
@rmartin: and where does all the money US steals from people that is refused a visa? any charitable organization? Why not making it refundable? And also, to get a US visa people have to go to a mountain of paperwork, hostility, and all that you describe, so what?
@ people who talk about traveling with families: if whole families want to travel to the US, there is also the US$131 for EACH person, and, again, if they are refused the visa they never see that money again. If they are refused entry to the country (which is even more sadistic) they lose the money they invested in plane tickets. THAT DOESN’T HAPPEN TO US CITIZENS ENTERING ARGENTINA. Just pay the fee, stop crying about it.
@Tio Louie: Thanks, that was my point.
@ Mary: I think the problem I have with your comments (both) is that you seem to have the mentality that US people will save the world, that you are so good and powerful that other countries should be thankful for your (our) visit. I could not disagree more with your view, I won’t even bother with the details. It’d be good if we stop making foreign policies that keep other countries under our thumb.
@alfC: you were short on your numbers: just the work permit this year went up to $380…sadly, what both of you pay is way more that $2000 a year.
@Gus: look at home, too, for the crime and corruption (and bureaucracy, and…) is here as well, it’s just not THAT explicit. I could understand other reasons why you’re not going to Argentina, but not that one, ’cause we have the same.
My wife and I have vacationed in AR the past two years. The $131.00 would not stop me but on top of the crime and corruption, this years vacation will be in the good old USA.
I don’t know about corruption (and how in particular it affects your visit to BA) but obviously the crime rate or more specifically the murder rate will not deter you to STAY in the US, look at this:
http://www.dlc.org/ndol_ci.cfm?kaid=108&subid=900003&contentid=255032
Murder rates per 100,000 people for 2006 or designated year:
World (2004): 7.6
U.S. Total (2008): 5.6
Argentina: 5.2
Hey!, we should start investigating US citizens that enter Argentina (and charge them $131 to investigate them), they can come to Buenos Aires and kill everyone!. See how humiliating it is? “you seem nice, but please pay us $131 so we can check if you are a decent person.”
(Again, I may rather prefer not to charge anyone from either side)
We should also start tracking of all these illegals that come to Argentine from the North — and start checking for those who overstay; there are tons — under some lame pretext like “I’m just here doing volunteering work”. BS, tell your mama that; your ass is unemployed in the USA and you’re leaving off your UP check and in Argentina because you can’t afford to live anywhere else.
Even if that were the case with a significant number of “tourists,” and I don’t think it is, wouldn’t it still be in some way positive for Argentina to have these people coming to spend their money in Argentina? It’s an easy net gain that provides an injection of additional money into the local economy. That, in turn, creates jobs and wealth for Argentines. That’s not to say breaking visa and immigration rules is acceptable, of course. On the whole, however, it’s hard to see how this would be bad for the country. Saludos, Taos
LOL —- the U.S. us so steeped in corruption that you don’t notice. It’s all tied up with a bow to look pretty and legal. Have you even looked at the U.S. Congress lately — full of crooks and liars. The cluelessness of your (American Exceptional) response is breathtaking.
Oh well, let’s see what they think of next to get money. That will be $131, taken out of the tourist pocket by the Casa Rosada and which was probably earmark to be spent in the local economy,
While it is true the U.S. government does make it difficult for foreigners to get into the U.S. (unless you are Mexican), WE did have terrorists attack our country. Argentina has not. Additionally, the reasons for Argentines and Brazilians to get visas are:
1. There is a notable amount of issues on the northern border of Argentina/Brazil with a number of middle easterners involved. It is a terrorist cell area and is monitored very closely by the U.S. government.
2. Americans come as tourists and SPEND money. Argentines/Brazilians also do, but some also try to obtain employment illegally and stay beyond the amounted time.
excuses, excuses.
Argentina have had “terrorist” attacks, AMIA and Israel embassy. But… that was used to mark the Argentina as unsafe, ah, no,no,no but if a terrorist attack happens in the US is because the *rest* of the world is unsafe.
1. jaja, pure BS, 20 years repeating that, it may become true, WMD also? (BTW I think they are not middle easter anymore they are Misioneans –from Misiones province–.) We can use peaks in the consumption of hummus to detect terrorist cells!! What a great idea. http://www.boingboing.net/2007/11/06/fbi-hunted-terrorist.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+boingboing%2FiBag+(Boing+Boing)
2. Hey, I am American too, I was born in Argentina (you known near south america), and as American I have the right to work in any place in “America”.
alfC-
There is no need to patronize others. I know where Argentina is…I live here. I have my own income and do not take anything from the wonderful “system” of the Argentine government. If you are American, then why is your English so deplorable?
BTW Argentines who are denied visas for whatever reason, do get their money back for their plane tickets, if purchased the correct way. I don’t make the rules for either country. I think a valid passport should be sufficient for EVERYONE and an international database set up to monitor when individuals are traveling outside of their own country. Whatever. At least in the U.S. there are no extra banking fees and “special ” prices for foreigners that take advantage of them as much as possible.
I am American because I was born is South America, is that difficult to understand? My English is deplorable in part because I was raised and born in Argentina and I don’t have any other citizenship. I was trying to raise your consciousness about using the word “Americans” in “Americans come as tourist”. But, … I will make my best effort to improve my written English in these posts.
I never mentioned plane tickets, I did say that “visa fees” are not refundable, and I have to pay them every single year that I have been in the US.
I agree, Argentinean banks charge me also when I withdraw the money that I earn lawfully in the US. But this is about governments and how two of them, US AND Argentina’s (in different ways), make everything so difficult for the common good.
Sorry for my poor English.
NB: Look, I love the US, or more specifically the people, the city and the area the where I ended up living, and universities where I ended up studying and doing my research. But each time I see a logical non sequitur as yours it drives me nuts. It makes me crazy to see people like you, and the US government applying the same logic. I drives me crazy to think that everything I love about the US will
be gone because of it. I learned here in the US that I never should apologize for my English, something that I should start doing for you.
First of all, let me apologize about my remark regarding your English skills. It was inappropriate. I was a bit confused because you said you were “American”. O we call ourselves “Americans”. What would you prefer? I use the adjective but did not invent it. Please do not shoot the messenger. This point is a bit juvenile.
Listen I understand your comments and frustrations. The world is not “normal” right now…in the U.S. or Argentina however you cannot compare the 1st world with the 3rd world in any form. In the U.S. there is crime and corruption as well but at least people are punished for it and it is not a way of life for everyone. I will not comment any further on this topic. Argentina will impose said fee and will suffer its consequences.
Apologies accepted and I take the opportunity to apologize for patronizing (“near south america”), it was just to remark that Argentina is in the American Continent, and ended up being a bad joke. I should have remarked that in some other way. After all my English is indeed deplorable (well, I have my days).
We are all messengers after all, you understand my point and how we should take responsibility for the meaning of our language, I don’t care when I hear “we americans” here in the US taking about customs or food, but when they talk about “americans” in the context of foreign policy the connotations become a mess.
I understand your frustration too, because I, as Argentinean, have been victim of visa fees too for many years and that is why I would rather prefer no fees for anyone.
It took me many years living in Argentina to realize (probably after I moved to the US) that the “non normal” excuse is invented to be exploited by the few people that benefit from the idea that the situation is “not normal”. In Argentina, we are still victims of the the law of “emergencia económica” and permanent situation of emergency to justify special power to the executive and superministers. In a more international context the same excuse is used by goverments to impose their Orwellian states, (which includes visa fees). The reality is that we always live in “normal times” in one sense of another, they can be bad times or not but please stop saying the “situation is non normal” to justify rules against the liberty of the people of the world who wants to live and imagine that their times are just normal. When was the world normal in any case, in 1910, 20, 30, 40, 50, 60, 70, 80, 90, 2000?
So, when I see the US people to buy the, non normal, extraordinary measures, mesianic policies to justify rules against its own admirable principles, it drives me crazy. The visa fees is just a tiny (even innocent) consequence of this perverted logic.
AlfC
You are so right.
And ironically i’d like to add that if i had to choose, I’d choose the entry fee in the US and not choose what they REALLY do with the money. Or all other things horrible they do to justify their so called superiority on the rest of the world.
“You are so right.
And ironically i’d like to add that if i had to choose, I’d choose the entry fee in the US and not choose what they REALLY do with the money. Or all other things horrible they do to justify their so called superiority on the rest of the world.”
You do really seem to hold a grudge against Americans… Relax man… All that hatred can be bad for your health… Besides, you can stop worrying about the visa fees… why would you want to visit a country that you hate so much anyway? Or are you using this as yet another excuse to bash the US? Ohhh now I get it… Go ahead, dude… Vent all your anger and frustrations… Just don’t get too emotional…
Oh well well i get your point.
You are SO wrong.
The reason that BRazilians and Argentines have to get a visa to enter the US is NOW the “terrorist border”, a made up reason after 9/11.
Brazilians AND Argentines were cherged much before that!!!
And argentines get pissed of cuzz after Menem and De La Rua broke the country (again) they feel that retroceeding to paying a visa to enter the US (a tax that were suspended only during the Menem years) meant being second class citizens.
Visa or not, argies should know that if the US thinks argies are 2nd class citizens, they should be happy, cuzz I think the US thinks argies rank much lower than that.
So if you believe the reason AFTER 9/11, which i dont even believe the us said that about Brazil and argentina, fine.
But both countries were charged the same way much before the US even thought about terrorism.
Actually, one more thing: Argentina, Brazil, Chile… all former dictatorships in the region… we know you very well, US terrorists.
Please publish!
“Actually, one more thing: Argentina, Brazil, Chile… all former dictatorships in the region… we know you very well, US terrorists.”
I thought those dictatorships came as a reaction to the emergence of marxist guerrilla movements all over the region… Do Montoneros and ERP ring a bell? We know you very well left-wing terrorists…
what a bunch of bullshit! the usa treats foreigners arriving (no matter from where, I have a Norwegian passport) as CRIMINALS. and potential threats. You make things difficult for people to go the states, but it is about time you realize that the world is not your little playground. what comes around goes around. i find the fee totally just. you dont want to go? dont go. or pay.
@rmartin: apparently you confused alfC’s post with mine, I did talk about plane tickets, and I won’t even ask you what you mean by “purchased the right way” because we’ll get too off track.
Now, regarding what you could do about the term “American”, you (and we all) could start calling ourselves “US citizen(s)”, for lack of a better term. It is true that most of the rest of the people in the Americas find it offensive that people in the US call themselves “Americans” as if they (we) were the only ones. Saying that you didn’t invent it is just a childish excuse.
Regarding the “terrorist attacks”, before getting into a victim position, you have to get better informed. In Argentina tons of innocent people died in the two episodes, the AMIA and the Israel Embassy, and lots of people suffered great financial loss. That is a sensitive issue for Argentineans as well.
And my last remarks, why do you live in Argentina if you seem so unhappy about it?
Quoting your post: “At least in the U.S. there are no extra banking fees and “special ” prices for foreigners that take advantage of them as much as possible.”
I think you missed reading the other posts that talk about the fees that US imposes on foreigners, please scroll up and read them. Did you know that, just a quick example, in the US, universities and community colleges charge foreigners between 700 and 900% more per unit? (Yes, between 7 to 9 times more per unit). Talk about fees, man! just for being foreign nationals! Go ahead and check the fees that your college (if you went to one, if not pick one at random) charges for “non-residents”or “international students”.
And the last one, I promise: you seem to have forgotten that here, if you use an ATM that is not from your bank, you also pay a bank fee!!! What were you talking about for goodness gracious! (yes, I did read the post on the fees, again you are whining about something that does happen in the US, but you only see it when it comes from some other government).
No mas.
Si mas, in re-reading my last post, I didn’t mean an offensive tone on any of my remarks in parenthesis, and now I realize that they can be misunderstood. Sorry, I meant no offense.
oh, and please quit the “1st-3rd world” talk, that is irritating for some people (and will open up another branch in this discussion).
I believe the fee is not a preposterous one. I have a B1/B2 type visa (this is my second one) which will expire after 10 years. I had to pay for the PIN and a fee just to get to the U.S. Embassy. I was one of the “lucky” ones, seeing as a lot of people were branded the DENIED word (and a lot of people are given short term visas e.g. 1 year) Whilst entering the country, I’ve seen people being denied entry.
Americans will only get to pay this fee ONCE every 10 years just to ENTER the country. See the difference? I’ve always believed the country should charge tourists a fee (no matter the nationality).
I am now applying for an Exchange Student Visa and I’ve had to pay US$ 15 for the PIN, US$ 131 fee AND up to US$ 200 for the SEVIS form. The US$ 346 I’ve paid thus far does not guarantee I will be granted the visa. Hopefully, I will (if not, and considering I’m a student, I will lose a LOT of money)
Argentina should not charge not cuzz it isnt fair, BUT because they NEED you tourism, americans.
And many other americans not paying taxes in BSaS with their businesses NEED other americans to keep coming and spending cuzz they charge you also in dollars, otherwise they could NOT survive Argentina’s inflation and – most importantly – Argentine’s rip offs.
Instead of complaining about the 131 USD fee, you should try to check the rent market (even though i think by this time it is too iffected by prices in dollars already, even though it is illegal), and see how much more you pay to rent a flat or a room, not only cuzz they charge you in dollars (which is always in a rise) but also cuzz they charge much more AND in dollars to foreigners, no matter if you rent for years.
All the rip offs.
A.R is TOTALLY right, Expat Brazil. Dont play with what you do not know too much (even though you “say” you are in Brazil…
Mexicans are the disgrace of the so called “Latinos”. BTW, they are not Latinos because they’re Aztecas.
I grew up with many Mexicans in the U.S. Some of them were in the country legally, others illegally. In general, the vast majority of them were honest, extremely hard-working people who simply wanted to create a better life for themselves and their families. This is not to condone the violation of immigration and other laws. Even so, does breaking such laws automatically make Mexicans a disgrace? Saludos, Taos
Hey Francesca: visa for Argies is not right, huh?
Is it right for Brazilians??? Bolivians???
I am really interested in what you have to say.
I think that 130 US$ for 10 years is not very bad but I also agree that a country which is a little bit in economic trouble should ask for MORE tourism (that brings money) and any restriction is a problem for the economy… A tourist spends much more than 130 US$ in a country so why to make this tax and risk that some tourists decide to change their mind? I think we should think to our interest first so…For USA and Argentine tourist is not very important cause they cannot bring too much money and anyway a Rich Argentine tourist doesn’t mind to pay to get in the country so….USA cha leave without Argentine Tourists but Argentina Tourism Industry cannot survive without American Tourists…We should think in this way.
It would be nice to know how much of the tourists coming to Argentina are from the united states. (really, stop calling yourselves Americans as if the rest of the continent doesn’t exist!). Reading the comments here gives the impression that all tourists coming to Argentina are from North America.
I’m not American [Northern or Southern] but $130 entry fee [for 10 years] doesn’t seem too bad. I don’t think Argentina will lose too many tourist dollars because a tourist who has trouble affording the entry fee isn’t likely to spend too much while in the country anyway. As for the USA, the way they treat people at immigration [my wife is Chinese], I wouldn’t even transit through that country.
In the U.S.A. we have always called ourselves Americans. Blacks call themselves African Americans, Mexicans – Mexican Americans, and so on. Nothing personal, thats just the way it is and always will be. You can call yourself whatever you want but don’t tell me what to call myself!
Gus,
In your own country, amongst like-minded people, you can call yourself whatever you want. But on a forum discussing Argentina, you might want to be a little more sensitive to the feelings of others. Whether you like it or not, geographically, Argentines are as American as you.
GOOD response! I thought this was about visas anyway? All of a sudden we are supposedly wrong by calling ourselves “American”. This is a complete banal topic. Your point was great.
I am argentine and I am against the fee. We need tourists and their money! Instead of promoting tourism to Argentina we do everything we can against it. And don’t tell it is because we argentinians are treated bad by the inmigration officers, the visa money is gone if you don’t get one, etc. Of course all this is true, but you are free to avoid the US. I don’t want to travel there! The World is big enough and there is enough countries where we are wellcomed, why the USA?
The same are going to thing the Americans about Argentina
Dear Gus,
I usually refrain from calling people names, but you leave me no choice but to identify you as typically pig-headed and reflective of what is labeled around the world as “the ugly AMERICAN” and only then can you appropriate a term that has been hijacked by the United States incorrectly labeling people from this country as AMERICAN. Used correctly, that term refers to people who hail from Canada to as far south as Argentina and in the Caribbean. We are all AMERICAN. In any foreign language, including Castilian, when referring to us (and yes, I am born in the United States) we are “Estadounidenses” (U.S.’ers). Just because we use it and have forced others by defaul to use it, doesn’t make it correct or shed light on the fact that we are being insensitive to others who happen to be North American, Central American or South American. They are very much American as we.
“Negro” was a term used in the U.S.A. through the 60′s, but we have evolved in soceity and you would not dream of utilizing such a callous and offensive term in the face of an an African-American.
So, my dear Gus, there is a difference between identity (which is whatever you choose to call yourself) and geographical labeling (please refer to the National Geographic Family Reference Atlas of the World: United States). But more importantly, when utilizing the term “American” to solely refer to people from the United States is to purposely and disrespectfully exclude 946 million people who share the same label with us as full-fledged Americans.
hahaaha well said tio louie!! but dont worry, because, unfortunately , united states people has bad fame cause of things like this, and is because there are some of them that are sooo ignorant that thinks that outside united states there is all desert and the tv hasnt arrive to them,, so they has that arrogant way of saying things, that maybe the other countries, learn how to not do it…. My bf is from united states and at first i have lot of questions like ” do u all says like sprrrrrringg breakkk uuuuu !!!booobs everywhere” and my bf was like, ehhh no,, is the fu.. movies that instead of showing the best people or things about usa, decide to show the worst and then pretend that the rest of the world dont laugh about them or consider them like dumbbb people,,,apart that when u travel to places like mexico or u see them here they are like kind of out of control! ajaj so no worth to explain to this kind of people,, is al p! jaaj anyway, being an argentine and representative of south american, i appreciate your respectfull way towards the others
Dear TioLuoie,
If you want to call yourself an “Estadouindenes” thats your business. Calling myself an American doees not mean I am insensitive. If North Americans, Central Americans and South Americans want to call themselves American thats fine with me, just don’t tell me not to call myself American. As far as being an Ugly American it’s people like you who jump to conclusions about Americans (is that U.S. Americans or other Americans? Which ones are ugly?) that give citizens of all of the Americas a pain in the Ass. I have lived in Mexico, Guatemala and El Salvador and have traveled to Cuba and Argentina and have never been criticized for calling myself an American or accused of being insensitive.I don’t know why you put Negro into this but I guess you want to be as sensational as possible. I know African Americans and whites that still use the word Negro and have never seen either one get upset about it. I think your writing about what you guess peoples reactions are and probably have no real face to face experience.And I don’t need to refer to the National Geographic Family Reference Atlas of the
World to know that it’s -
The United States of AMERICA.
AMERICA the Beautiful.
God Bless AMERICA.
Made in AMERICA.
A M E R I C A. Get it. I was born in the United States of America. I am an American.
God Bless AMERICA
‘Almighty God, bless our arms when the time comes; be just as thou hast always been; judge now whether we be deserving of freedom; Lord, bless our battle!’
-Adolf Hitler’s prayer (Mein Kampf)
Oy.
Well said, Gus!!!! I’m South American and have always thought of Americans as people from the US… When someone calls themselves American, everyone automatically understands that they are from the US. It can’t possibly lead to confusion, since no one else uses the term ‘American’ to refer to their nationality. They just call themselves Argentine, Brazilian, Paraguayan, Canadian, etc, and when referring to the region they belong to they use the terms South American, North American or Central American.
Besides, in the English language the term ‘American’ refers exclusively to people from the US… I don’t see why anyone would be offended by that, unless of course they have some kind of deep-seated issue… But in that case, it would be THEIR problem, not yours…
antonio,
Maybe you’re right but isn’t this more about just getting along with people who think differently to you. For example, if you go out to dinner with someone who’s a vegetarian and finds the eating of meat offensive, what would you do? Say it’s their problem and order a big jucy steak? Or take their views into account, even if you don’t agree with them? If someone takes offence to you calling yourself ‘american’, just call yourself something else. Is that too difficult? Many of the world’s problems are caused by people who can’t make compromises or take the views of others into account.
@antonio and Gus, I (and I think other) don’t personally get offended if you use the word “American”. I stated that in the original comment. I am just telling you that it makes your discourse weaker in this context.
k,
In case you didn’t notice, this is an English-speaking forum, and as i said before, the correct usage of the term ‘American’ in English is to refer to someone or something from the United States. If you expect US citizens to change the name by which they call themselves in their own language, then it is you who is being insensitive and disrespectful. Have you ever thought that maybe it is you who isn’t making enough of an effort to get along with others? Because, as I see it, telling others to change the way they call themselves isn’t exactly a display of tolerance and understanding…
“Many of the world’s problems are caused by people who can’t make compromises or take the views of others into account.”
Exactly!!! Some people in this world are so unwilling to compromise that it is beyond belief… Some even go to the extent of not accepting what other nations choose to call themselves in their native language… Go figure….
[...] Exhibit Opens At Abasto Shopping Mall UPDATE: New Fee Hits Cash Withdrawals At Link ATMs (69)Argentina to Charge Americans an Airport Entry Fee (48)UPDATE: Argentina’s New Entrance Fee Postponed (32)A Personal Note from the Editor [...]
I was in Argentina in September and it is a wonderful country. The people are very nice and the steaks were incredible. I’m glad I went and did not have to pay $131 for being a citizen of the USA. The U.S. State Department should probably refund fees if a visa is denied but should it surprise anyone that said fees aren’t refunded? Probably not. Foreign (i.e. non USA) governments charging U.S. citizens fees to enter their countries are understandable but not the best policy given the current worldwide recession.
A very simple solution for U.S. citizens is to visit countries that do not charge these “tit for tat” fees. This past year I visited some amazing countries like Honduras, Nicaragua, Colombia, Ecuador, Uruguay, and Argentina. Of these six countries, only Argentina will be charging entrance fees. Go to Colombia; it’s great!
antonio,
You say .. “the correct usage of the term ‘American’ in English is to refer to someone or something from the United States.” Maybe, maybe not.
In just in this short thread, 4 people have disagreed: TioLouie, Ronald, A.R. and alfC. A quick check of ‘American’ in my Concise Oxford Dictionary gives a first definition as … “Belonging to continent of America”. Only the second definition is … “belonging to the United States”.
Wikipedia states … “In modern English “American” generally refers to the United States, and in the U.S. itself this usage is almost universal, with any other use of the term requiring specification of the subject under discussion. However, this ambiguity has been the source of controversy, particularly among Latin Americans, who feel that using the term solely for the United States misappropriates it.
Now, in case you didn’t notice, this forum is discussing a Latin American country and, obviously, many participants will be from Latin America. So why be ambiguous and controversial by using the word ‘American’ to refer only to people fron the USA?
Because a word has a common meaning in the USA doesn’t make it right.
I entered American in Google and the first nine pages listed nothing that was not in or of the United States of America. I did not go any further. When I entered The Americas, from the very first page it listed South America, Central America, North America and numerous groups, orginazations, schools, etc. all relating to all of The Americas. Hardly anything refered to The United States of America. Words have different effects in different languages but it’s nothing to get bent out of shape over. American or of The Americas may have different meanings to different people but we can agree to disagree and move on.
Merry Christmas to all and to all goodnight. God Bless.
There are several issues raised in this thread that relate to the article (and a bunch that do not LOL): is the US Visa requirement a good idea? Is the cost of applying for a US Visa reasonable? Is the Argentinian entry fee fair Is the Argentinian entry fee a good idea? I’d like to tackle each.
I think the requirement imposed on Argentinians in BEFORE the terrorist attacks is a bad one. The original reason was to lower the risk of Argentinians illegally staying in the US in order to exploit the better economic environment. It had little to do with security or defending against terrorists. I don’t like it, and people who’ve been supporting it seem to be xenophobes who don’t care about the rest of the world or understand how US policies like this (and many others) actually impact thier own lives negatively. Another example: I’m constantly amazed at how many Americans who would benefit greatly from universal healthcare are opposing it.
I think the US fees are reasonable, the State Department puts as much effort into processing a Visa application whether or not it is approved. They do the same amount of investigating and research either way. Expecting a refund if your application is denied seems odd.
I think the Argentinian entry is reasonable if they insist on charging one. $131 isn’t that much when you’re going to be spending at least $1200 on airfair and $75 or more per day on hotels, cars, food, et cetera per person. But I think its a bad idea because its going to make some people decide to visit someplace else. Its not going to help Argentina and its not going to make the US State Department change their policy. The people supporting this fee don’t seem to care what its economic impact will be on Argentina, only that people from the US suffer in some way. That’s short-sighted vindictiveness, not a good way to build a lasting and healthy society.
In other words, I think both are stupid ideas.
There are some nasty comments in this thread, some people make absurd assumptions and generalizations. Mary tried to explain what she believed was the rationale behind the US policy, that doesn’t mean she supports it and it certainly does not indicate that she thinks the US is the world savior! And if Gus wants to call himself an American why should anyone else care? How does his use of the word affect you? Why expand this thread totalk about the broader US foreign policies or the causes of Argentina’s economic problem over the last 15 years? While those are interesting subjects of discussion they have nothing to do with the original article. Go start a new thread at BAExpats
From the Orbitz site:
“Beginning Dec. 20, 2009, the Argentine government is scheduled to begin charging an entry fee of $131 USD to citizens of 22 countries, including the United States and Canada. It will be collected only at Buenos Aires Ezeiza International Airport (EZE).”
It looks like the US is not alone in this, there are other 21 countries that will be charged the fee, so, again, “we better not cry…”
Ha Ha! I´m flying in from Uruguay to BA´s local Palermo airport on the 20th and then later returning to New York. Doesn´t affect me!
Obviously citizens of rich countries like English lands, EU, Switz, Japan shouldn´t be restricted from entry or charged for it. But to restrict entry from poor countries like Argentina is normal from a border integrity standpoint.
This will negatively impact the Argentine economy, as any tarriff.
Wow, the commentary above is (unintentionally) HILARIOUS. Originally I was just looking up info on the Kirchner tax to fly into Ezeiza from the USA (Cristina needs her botox touch up and Nestor has that bionic eye implant coming soon, you know).
But after reading this pap, all I can say is that I’ve never seen such a group of whiny, politically correct liberals that need a good buttkicking so they understand how the world REALLY works, instead of boo-hoo-hooing that so-and-so is American but no they aren’t and that one over there is SOMETHING-American, but that offends the Argentines (who like to push each other out of helicopters over the Rio de la Plata so they can be properly desaparecido, BTW), and on an on this hand-wringing and wailing goes.
The USA charges the Argentinians (and Brazilians and Chileans and Bolivians, etc, etc) the fee because, without it, they would apply for a tourism visa every day of the week in hopes of “winning the lottery”… only to stay for good, once firmly in the USA. But now that Argentina is charging a “reciprocity fee”, it’s time for Americans (the USA variety!) to sneak into Argentina and “tit for tat” them… by refusing to leave, and work illegally. Or maybe just join the piqueteros and protest the right NOT to work — yet continue getting a paycheck from the state!!
Born in the U.S. and half Argentine, just want to share with some of the men in this stream who have responded with such vigor on the appropriateness of the term AMERICAN, since I know that the women on board have more balls to respond in such a fashion, that my favorite tee-shirt is, “Men with loud motorcycles have small dicks!”
The latest update is that the implementation of the reciprocity fee has been delayed until JANUARY 1st. If you can read Spanish, check out the notice in Clarin:
http://www.clarin.com/suplementos/viajes/2009/12/20/v-02104311.htm
(then again, who knows…. it’s Argentina so be prepared either way)
k,
Your quoting of that dictionary proves nothing. Dictionaries tend to include ALL possible definitions for a term. This means they will also give meanings that are not widely accepted in daily speech and therefore are never utilized. That being said, it’s up to one’s inteligence to figure out which ones are in use and which ones are not… For example, in this case, the English-speaking world NEVER utilizes the term ‘American’ to mean ‘belonging to the continent of America’. English-speakers only make use of it when meaning ‘belonging to the US’. Come on, when was the last time you heard an English-speaker pronounce the word ‘American’ to mean anything other than ‘belonging to the US’?As for your quoting of Wikipedia, I really don’t see how that invalidates any of what I said. First of all, the ambiguity issue was never present in this forum. Any person with at least an average IQ would realize that every time the term ‘American’ was used here, it was only to refer to US citizens and not to anything else. The usage of the term was very clear. It couldn’t possibly hold any other meaning in this context.
“However, this ambiguity has been the source of controversy, particularly among Latin Americans, who feel that using the term solely for the United States misappropriates it.”
Since there was no ambiguity here, there shouldn’t be any controversy, either.. Besides, this fragment makes it very clear that the controversy comes from the Latin Americans who question the usage of the term ‘American’ in English, rather than from the US citizens who use it to refer to themselves. That is, the controversy here does not lie with the US citizens for calling themselves Americans but with the Latin Americans who refuse to accept it. If they just accepted it and stopped whining, the controversy would be over. As simple as that… So, tell me, k, why do you like to be so controversial?
“Now, in case you didn’t notice, this forum is discussing a Latin American country and, obviously, many participants will be from Latin America. So why be ambiguous and controversial by using the word ‘American’ to refer only to people from the USA?”
By using the word ‘American’ to refer only to people from the US, no one is being ambiguous nor controversial. They are just making correct use of the English language… In case you didn’t realize it, there is no other word to call US citizens in English. The only correct name for their nationality is ‘American’, whether you like it or not. And as proven above, the controversy is created by people like you who just can’t stop whining about it.On the other hand, the fact that many participants here are from Latin America doesn’t change a thing… The forum is still an English-speaking one, and therefore any participants in it must respect the rules of the English language, regardless of their nationality. Being Latin American does not entitle you to force others to change the way they speak. Thus, you have no right to demand US citizens stop calling themselves Americans. They are speaking their own language, you’re not. So, why should they adjust to you? If anything, it is YOU who should adjust to them. This forum was made for English-speakers, so technically you are in their turf. The least you could do is have some respect for their language. One of the requirements for participating in any forum is to adjust to the language spoken in it. If you are not willing to do that, then why participate here? Go to another site where your own language is spoken. That way, you won’t be offended and you surely won’t offend others with your intolerance and disrespect. Is that too difficult?
“Because a word has a common meaning in the USA doesn’t make it right.”
Evidently, you are so narrow-minded that you can’t even accept that a word can have different meanings in different languages, and that it doesn’t make it right or wrong but just ermm… different. You obviously think that your views are the only valid ones and that everyone who doesn’t coincide with them is wrong and has to change. This thinking just shows your arrogance. I can’t believe you are the same person who talked so much about ‘getting along with others’ and ‘respecting other views’. Because so far you have consistently proven to do the exact opposite. You make no effort whatsover to get along with others and don’t even respect the speakers of a foreign language, expecting them to adapt to your demands. Maybe in your own arrogance you thought that those statements are to be observed by all except you and those who agree with you. How convenient… At least be consistent with your own statements and PRACTICE WHAT YOU PREACH.
The word ‘American’ is used to refer exclusively to US citizens by ALL of the English-speaking world, not just the US. And I’m sorry to disappoint you but that’s not going to change just because a bunch of narrow-minded people don’t like it. So why not open your mind a bit and just accept it? Believe me, when you start getting rid of your arrogance and intolerance, you’ll feel much more in harmony with the world around you and with yourself… I know, it’s hard work, but the end result will be worth it, I can guarantee you that…
Season’s Greetings,
I have been following this thread with avid interest for the last few days and I would just like to congratulate Antonio on an excellent piece of writing as well as a very clear and complete explanation of the adjective “American” in the English language.I have been living here for 31 years and have always said that I was a “neoyorquino” in order to avoid any possible friction.
After reading so many complaints about the supposed misuse of the word American,I am telling all the waiters in the coffee bars I have been frequenting for years that they should not refer to a coffee otherwise known as “un cafe en jarrito” as “un americano” unless they want to run the risk of being branded “un cipayo” or even worse “un pityanqui” as Chavez and Fidel call us, the correct term would be” “un norteamericano” or better still “un estadounidense”.
FELICES FIESTAS—– HAPPY HOLIDAYS !!!
Brian McKenna and Antonio,
Great information and writing fom both of you. I have forwarded your posts to several America, Mexican and South American friends and they agree completly. Now I’ll take a chance in this politically correct era that some fools are in and say,
Merry Christmas from an American Citizen.
“A fool and his or her money will soon be partying!”
The Argentine politcos will just stuff this money in their pockets while merchants and businesses in Argentina that sell to American tourists will suffer.
The Argenitnes have no soul. They will sell their mothers and children to get one more peso (which is worth about zero in the world, and will now be worse).
Well, Antonio, I’ve really no idea what I said that was so controversial that you became so agitated, wrote that ridiculous post and, in the process, made such a total ass of yourself. The number of inconsistencies and contradictions is mind-blowing and from your very first sentence …” Your quoting of that dictionary proves nothing”, it was the ‘Oxford btw, pretty much everything you wrote is inaccurate or just plain wrong. But, I’m sorry; I don’t have the time or patience to correct you. I’ll just quote one sentence that, to me, says everything about you …
” the controversy here does not lie with the US citizens for calling themselves Americans but with the Latin Americans who refuse to accept it. If they just accepted it and stopped whining, the controversy would be over. As simple as that…”
Yeah, now I get it … just do things the US way and everything will be fine. Antonio, you’re an embarrassment to the human race and I was lying when I said that I don’t have the time or patience to correct you. I do, but you’re such an ignorant barbarian that I know I’d just be wasting my time.
Btw, what made you think I’m Latino? In my very first post I introduced myself with …”I’m not American [northern or southern]”. But, since you think all Americans come from the USA, I now realise why you didn’t understand what I meant and maybe you thought ‘southern’ meant Texas or some such place.
Actually, I’m English, born and bred, and I’m pretty sure that I understand the English language much better than you do. Have you any idea how galling it is to be lectured on the use of the English language by someone who isn’t even English. You could at least refer to the language you speak as American-English rather than English. Your post demonstrates that you fail to understand many of the nuances of the English language. For example … “doesn’t make it right” doesn’t mean ‘makes it wrong’ as you seem to think. It just means there can be different interpretations – as in the use of the word ‘American’. The fact that we’re having this discussion clearly demonstrates that the word ‘American’ can have more than one meaning, which you appear, in your arrogance, to be unable to understand or accept.
But, to get back on track, yes, “I’m American” USUALLY means I come from the USA. But, not always and, when talking to those from Central and South America, I think “I’m North American” would be more prudent, polite and appropriate [I’m sure the Canadians wouldn’t object]. But, like I already said … I just know I’m wasting my time trying to reason with you; I doubt that the word ‘polite’ is even in your vocabulary.
K — I’m English USUALLY means I come from Great Britain. But not always and, when talking to those from America, Australa, Canada and other English speaking countries, I think “I’m from Great Britain” would be more prudent, polite and appropiate (I’m sure Scotland wouldn’t object) Polite people do not call a person an ass, ignorant, a barbarian, an embarressment to the human race or any other nasty words. If you wouldn’t say it to a person face to face in public your showing your own total lack of understandig of how people communicate. I feel sorry for you because your relationships with others must be strained if they exist at all. You set a poor example for a citizen of Great Britain or whatever country your a citizen of.
I am an American citizen born in Texas. USA.
I am an Enlish speaking American born in Texas. A citizen of the United States.
Gus,
Your ignorance in geography is truly astounding. I guess it’s true what they say about North Americans. For your information Gus, Great Britain isn’t even a country. “I’m English” ALWAYS means I come from the country of England and, if I say I come from Great Britain [which I never would], I could be from England, Scotland or Wales.
K,
Actually, it is “The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland” which also includes Scotland and several islands. The names United Kingdom, U.K. and Britain are also used. You can call yourself English, British, U.K. or whatever you want to call yourself. No one cares what you call yourself. The main point was the use of nasty names you call people and Great Britain was to push your button. I’m sure almost everyone is sick of this discussion, I know I am, so this will be my final post on the subject.
Merry Christmas Brit.
Oh my goodness, we have all been served with an early Christmas present. Gus has sworn not to post anything else to this thread ~ Allelujah!!!
Feliz Navidad y todo lo mejor para todos los Americanos de la Argentina al Canada en el 2010!
Starting today Americans, December 28th 2009 have ready US131 to pay as an entry fee when visiting Argentina valid for 10 years and stop whining about everything.
Or, do not come. You dont have to…. Go to Ecuador, Paraguay, Uruguay, Colombia or any other country that does not charge you a fee when visiting and enjoy your avarice or pride… whatever you call it.
Americans call themselves Americans because their country name is United Stated of America. They cannot call themselves Unitedtians or Statetians, come on! ii is plain common sense!!
But when an American speaks Spanish (rare variety of Americans, admit this) they should say: Yo soy Estadounidense. That is the correct way to call themselves when speaking Spanish. And when reffering to their country the correct way is to say: los Estados Unidos ó los Estados Unidos de America.
Here is one joke:
How do you call a person that speaks 2 languages?
-Bilingual
How do you call a person that speaks 3 languages?
-Polyglot
How do you call a person that speaks 1 language?
-American
LOL
The new entry fee of $131pp or $524 for a working family of 4 really hits. That’s a big number for an American blue collar family to swallow, and possibly will keep them away. And we know the severe impact that will play on new Hotels, restaurants, tour guides, and yes, even professional drivers. It will do doubt cost many Argentine jobs, many of them at the lower end, like hotel maids, and dishwashers, etc. There will be a negative impact, big time.
I strongly oppose this new fee, and as far as rationale 2 – wrongs don’t make a right. Argentina is a soveirgn nation and ‘nation state’ and of course has every right to do things to hurt their own economy.
It’s the new ‘Berlin Wall’ theory that keeps people apart, it’s time to tear that wall down, and repeal the US fee, Visa requirement and likewise the Argentina reciprosity fee, that has so hurt Brazil, and Chile. Besides, the US needs good Argentine soccer players they can pay in dollars to win the World Cup for the US! And Argentina needs more tourism, and most of all, investment and tourism that creates much needed Argentine jobs, investment and development.
If you are in Argentina, and agree that this horrible new fee has to go away, please let me know. I’d like to hear from you.
LOL!
You can’t have foreign players in your national soccer team Fred!
I thought you could after they become citizens, I hear they do this all the time!
Just this last week I planed my first trip back to Argentina after living there from 2005-2007. I just found out about this new fee a few days ago. After spending $1383 dollars on a plane ticket, another $131 fee seems rough especially in these economic times. The thing I love about Argentina is that mostly everything (compared to the US) is cheap! The extra $131 kinda ruins that for me. Really all it means is less money I can spend on soveniers/food/travel expenses. Funny that a few people mentioned the possibily of the fee hurting tourism. On this trip I had the opportunity for a 16 hour layover in Rio de Genero. Thought It would be neat to visit Brazil even for the short amount of time I’d be there. But after learning about all the visa fees I said no way. I hope the Argentine people really make themselves heard on this issue. There is no doubt in my mind it will sigificantly hurt Argentina’s tourism industry. These “eye for an eye” politics really need to stop.
Erick,
I am so glad that the Obama administration had the foresight not to appoint you as Goodwill Ambassador nor that U.S. Ambassador to the UN, Susan Rice has not woven you into any of her diplomatic plans representing the United States internationally. I believe you are not worthy of a label as “racist,” because you probably treat everyone outside of the United States equally. But your pompous arrogance and narrow-mindedness only reinforces why the United States has lost so much respect on the world stage and is quickly losing its grip on world power.
It looks like hundreds of thousanda of people are dead or missing in Haiti. As in all disasters the United States will send massive aid.Hundreds of millions of dollars, U.S. Navy,Marines, Army ,Coast Guard and Airforce, Hospitol ships, search teams, food, medicine, Doctors, tents and much much more. This will be done by the U.S. Government, paid for with American taxpayer dollars and with no expectation of getting re-paid. This will be done with support of the American citizens regardless of the economy.The loud mouths that think the U.S. is loosing respect and it’s world power status will crawl back in their holes and shut up for a while. Then when the situation stabalizes they will come back out and start screaming again.They will not contribute anything to help. It’s the same old anti- American story. All BS and nothing to help anyone but themself.
My records indicate, Gus, that on December 24th, 2009 you stated, “I’m sure almost everyone is sick of this discussion, I know I am, so this will be my final post on the subject.” What we’re learning about you, whether you call yourself a U.S.’er, American or whatever you insist on calling yourself that you are not a man of your word. It’s like Freddie — you’re back!
My records indicate, TioLouie, it was my final post on the subject. The subject was English or British. Great Britain.England. It had nothing to do with the U.S. loosing respect or it’s world power status. Subject, not thread. By the way, I understand that you live in New York, New York, United States. Why?
I’ll be back! Are you feeling lucky?
I just read this idiot Rick talking about this law will prevent Argentines to stay and enjoy our “freedom” where in the world these assholes usa midgets citizens think they are Erick these words are for you there is no freedom in the usa is a militar fascist nation ruled by the murdering machine occupying nations Afghanistan Irak and on ,and on…
you guys are the laughing stock of the world…you have no friends only enemies and no future.
Boulder,Co
…why Argentines beat the usa in chess all the time…
reason being they don’t have the towers…
Obama what a joker!!!!!
What an idiot you are… and the worst part is you think your anti-american drivel makes you look smart…
I feel very blessed to be born in the United States and am a proud U.S.’er. Plus I work every day in making this country a better and stronger place. But it does not put the United States beyond reproach and in criticizing my country it only makes it stronger when we cite the weaknesses. Yes, it’s wonderful that the United States has jumped to help Haiti in its most desperate time of need. However, we also recognize, as Latin Americans (I am of Cuban-Argentine parentage born in NY and that makes me a true Latin American) that the United States has abused its super powers against other nations. There is no question that part of Haiti’s impoverished state is due to the United States and that our CIA orchestrated coups there like in so many other Latin American countries (try the original 09/11 in Chile in ’73 masterminded by none other than Kissinger). So, my dear Gus, if you can’t look at our country and be critical of its history so as to improve its future and relations with its neighbors, which include Latinos who comprise the largest ethnic group in this country ~ then let’s agree to disagree for we have very different politics and views on international relations and diplomacy.
TRUE PATRIOTISM
My country right or wrong. When right to be kept right, when wrong to be put right.
As an argentine/el salvadoran born in the u.s., I have a strong love for both the u.s. and argentina. I’ve been badly wanting to go to argentina, since it’s been about 5 years since I’ve been there. I live in chicago.. plane tickets to b.a. are not cheap. I can see how it can discourage visitors to travel to argentina just because of this entry fee. It seems like fees are popping up everywhere in the worst time to implement fees.
In my opinion argentina could use the tourism. Although I would probably pay the fee (since i have family there that i want to see), I can see tourists that would be discouraged and think twice about going to argentina because of this. I would perfer my hard earned money here in the u.s. to go to the restaurants, kioskos, heladerias, and hard working argentines than to the government of argentina.. where who knows what they would spend that money on. I’m not saying the u.s. is perfect and not corrupt..
There’s a reason why my father came to the u.s. over 40 years ago, legally i might add… He would always tell me how he kept hearing that it would take 10 years for argentina to get better.. then another 10 years.. and so on.. and nothing ever happened.. Argentina has so much potential.. so much land.. they should concentrate on finding ways to increase their GDP and be consistant. Dont hurt the tourism..
Bottom line, Americans; if you go to Argentina as someone said”to spend ur $” and america is such an amazing first world country, why are u crying over 130 bucks?! Really? And if u can’t afford it, then go somewhere else!! Bid deal!!!
I’m a Canadian from Toronto. I’ve been spending a lot of time in Buenos Aires for the past four years. Almost two full years at first with my partner then wintering here from December to April.
While here, I’ve been planning little three or four night getaways to nearby destinations including other cities in Argentina, Uruguay and Peru. As I scan through Google Maps thinking of other interesting places to visit, I simply put Chile and Brazil at the bottom of the list. Chile has a reciprocity fee for Canadians and Brazil actually requires Canadians to get a visa.
I figure, with so many other countries/places to visit that don’t require fees/visas, why go to a place that does? So, future trips will include Bolivia, Ecuador and returns to Uruguay and Peru. I’m sure if these fees/visas are influencing my destination choices, they’ll surely affect other gringos.
While I understand the philosophy/politics behind the fees and a small part of me agrees with them (I don’t think it’s fair that Argentines have to go through hell each time they want to visit Canada or the US), I wonder if it’s the wrong thing to do.
I think it would be interesting if the fee went into some kind of fund that would reimburse Argentines who pay Visa application fees but ultimately get rejected. Poetic Justice.
It’s pretty simple why the USA charges fees and is strict with immigration policies….millions of illegals (primarily Mexicans) are to thank for this. Sadly, good people (such as my Argentine family members) cannot receive Visas due to the threat of them staying. Don’t blame the USA….blame the illegals who are ruining this country!
JP,
Yeah, there’s always somebody else to blame. God forbid that anyone should have the temerity to blame the USA.
Yeah, I would not be so quick to single out the Mexicans as the issue here in the United States. Some Argentines have come here also and crapped it for Latinos. At the end of the day, buddy, why we have to be united as Latinos in teh USA is that when the Gringo thinks of us Latin Americans as the “boogy man,” no matter which country we hail from, they put us in one bucket ~ “the Latin American trash bucket!” In that respect, they don’t discriminate.